Wednesday, August 20, 2008

Allah's apostle misunderstanding and bastardizing a Christian parable

Sahih Bukhari; Volume 8, Book 76, Number 565:
Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri:
Allah's Apostle said, "When the people of Paradise have entered Paradise, and the people of the Fire have entered the Fire, Allah will say. 'Take out (of the Fire) whoever has got faith equal to a mustard seed in his heart.' They will come out, and by that time they would have burnt and became like coal, and then they will be thrown into the river of Al-Hayyat (life) and they will spring up just as a seed grows on the bank of a rainwater stream." The Prophet said, "Don't you see that the germinating seed comes out yellow and twisted?"

Bible (or the Injil, which Muslims are forbidden to read because it makes more logical sense than the Quran)

And he said, Whereunto shall we liken the kingdom of God? or with what comparison shall we compare it?It is like a grain of mustard seed, which, when it is sown in the earth, is less than all the seeds that be in the earth:But when it is sown, it groweth up, and becometh greater than all herbs, and shooteth out great branches; so that the fowls of the air may lodge under the shadow of it.
– Mark 4:30–2

The meaning of the mustard seed in the Christian context:

The parable compares the Kingdom of Heaven to a mustard seed which the parable says is the least among seed, yet grows to become a huge mustard plant that provides shelter for many birds.

In other words, something small and insignificant becomes something powerful.

The meaning of the mustard seed in the Muslim context:

Even having a little faith means you will eventually get out of the hell fire. However, you will become black and charred.

(Note that this logic is faulty because Muslims believe that you must first go to hell and pay for your sins before you go to heaven. You stay in hell in proportion to all the good things you did. Thus, if you were bad 1% of the time, you are in hell 1% of your after life. But, if the after life is infinite, that would mean you will spend the full after life in hell. --> 0.01/infinity = infinity) )

Further, Mohammad bastardizes the above parable by saying that having faith like a mustard seed makes one yellow and twisted, even if they go to heaven. As such, he is saying a person should have more faith than a mustard seed, and Mohammad makes an implicit assumption that having faith like a mustard seed is really pathetic.

1) Why did Bukhari include this hadith?
a) Was it to show that Mohammad, the illiterate prophet, did not really read the injil (bible) in coming up with his own parables?
b) Was it to show that Mohammad never read the injil (bible) to begin with, and as such, was not capable of making any ethical or philosophical judgments against Christianity, or any religion for that matter?
c) Or was it because by the time Bukhari wrote this, Muslims rulers commissioned him to write things that would demonize Christians, as the Christian doctrine is clearly far superior and logical coherent as compared to the Muslim docrtine, and any attack on Islam the religion could destabilize the political underinnings of keeping Muslim rulers as the ruling class?
2) Why did Mohammad not understand the biblical context of the mustard seed?
a) If Mohammad came to reassert the word of previous prophets and the messiah, why did he have to bastardize what they said?
b) Did Mohammad forbid the reading of the Injil (bible) to prevent muslims from finding out just how inept his own religious and theological background was?

2 comments:

Anonymous said...

Your assumptions and conclusions on finding ways to think that the quran/hadith bastardizes the bible is pathetic.

For example, your logic of .01/infinity = infinity. Good job deluding yourself. Afterlife is inifinite. But you're talking about spaces between hellfire and heaven, which your are displaced after a period of time.

So your math really is:

.01 in hell fire + infinity in heaven = infinity.

Sins are easily forgiven in Islam. If you are not forgiven for some sins, then you will be punished for them. If you commit an act of murder, or killing a family member, then you die without suffering a penalty, why would this person be committed to heaven immediately?

Making Christianity as an all purpose act of accepting criminals into heaven seems like an unjustifiable faith with no fear of reprocussions of your actions. Especially when God/Allah made the life for you to follow his words.

The bible also believes that the mustard seed is insignificant at first. Not just the quran. That is why the bible mentioned the mustard seed in the first place.

"It is like a grain of mustard seed, which, when it is sown in the earth, is less than all the seeds that be in the earth:But when it is sown.." Do you see the word "But" in there? "..but when it is sown." Why mention the mustard seed? Why not something bigger? Because it is insigificant. BUT then it grows into something more.

Its not that we are not allowed to read the bible. Its that we don't want to because the Qur'an makes more sense. All the Christian converts that I talked to also believe this.

Good day sir.

hhashmo said...

Anonymous - it is unfortunate you label my arguments pathetic, before you have even proved a point. I will go through each of your points in order.

1) your math is horrible

0.01 in hell fire (how long are you in the hell fire?) 0.01 seconds, 0.01 days, 0.01 years, or ... 0.01 of infinity (0.01*infinity = infinity)

2) your point about sins being easily forgiven in islam - it is arbitrary and capricious - you need to clarify your point as you don't make sense

3) God is not Allah. Illah is the Arabic word for God. Allah was the name of a pagan god in Macca. Mohammad's (Abu Al Qassim) (PBUH) father was named abdallah (slave to Allah) - here is a video disucssing Allah's origins http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkrgObVwTSc&feature=channel_page
if you want more info, please, ask.

4) Re "Making Christianity as an all purpose act of accepting criminals into heaven seems like an unjustifiable faith with no fear of reprocussions of your actions"

(4)(a)-I am assuming you are talking about the thief on the Cross:

Luke 23:39-43

[39] One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: "Aren't you the Christ? Save yourself and us!"

[40] But the other criminal rebuked him. "Don't you fear God," he said, "since you are under the same sentence? [41] We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong."

[42] Then he said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom."

[43] Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise."

From the passage - The thief who was forgiven was truly sorry and expected to go to hell. WHat was given to him was heaven as an act of grace.

Grace is concept that not many people do not understand, and I will not discuss it here

(4)(b) What does the thief in the cross analogy have anything to do with Mohammad (PBUH) misunderstanding a the mustard seed parable?

5) Concerning your point "The bible also believes that the mustard seed is insignificant at first."

The Christian point of view is that faith grows like a mustard seed. It starts of small, and then becomes something bigger.

The hadith states that having a small amount of faith, like a mustard seed will cause someone to be black and charred. And when it grows, the mustard plant becomes "yellow and twisted."

Clearly, the Christian version looked positively at the Mustard seed, whereas Mohammad (PBUH), who had a very difficult time understanding complex scenarios, like the Mustard seed example,

(See Mohammad's (peace be upon him) business planning when someone would cheat him http://muslimhadith.blogspot.com/2008/05/when-you-bargain-say-no-cheating.html)

could only manage to convolute and bastardize this parable.

6)RE: "Its not that we are not allowed to read the bible. Its that we don't want to because the Qur'an makes more sense."

Are you kidding me? Alexander the Great, born 1000 Islam was created, a man who thought of himslef as a god, is considered to be a good Muslim according to the 18th surah? (Dhul Qarnayn is Alexander the Great)http://muslimhadith.blogspot.com/2008/12/alexander-great-muslim.html

a) RE: "All the Christian converts that I talked to also believe this" I am assuming you are referring to people who converted from Christianity.

WHat did they read in the Quran? About how ALexander the Great was a Muslim? ABout how the The Noble Quran states that Mary, Mother of Jesus also the sister of Aaron and Moses? (Who were only separated by a couple of thousand years)

http://muslimhadith.blogspot.com/2008/12/mohammads-christmas-special_7190.html

Good day sir.